EXTEREMELY SIMPLE CONCEPT

[Admin]

IMHO, Paz is just pointing out some realities....in a very blunt fashion and prolly aimed at folks that do not have a grasp of them yet. Surely not aimed at discouraging EVERYONE, that's how I read it.

Someday, maybe there'll be harmony everywhere...but I can't remember it ever existing in racing. If you aren't fighting with technology it'll be with the cost of technology, and when you get that whipped then you got to deal with someone's good driver talent. Or the economy...or whatever.  Racing ain't perfect but if it makes us happy then we should do it. Lord knows my golf game sure don't bring happiness...

[ask0329]

I wont lie, i've complained about payouts before. Where I find it disheartening is the difference in pay between tracks for the same class. I've come to learn that if I'm not part of the solution, I'm part of the problem. I could go out and help the track and find a "class sponsor" but I dont. So I've learned to shut my mouth on the topic. All in all I shouldnt complain. On an average night I'll make $30 or lose $16. To go out and race, comradre at the track and all the fun to be had I cannot beat it. My racecar is worth as much as a snowmobile or a boat. We do have a boat but its just a 6 person open bow standard boat. Nothing special. No sleds or wheelers. Racing for us has grown to be a family thing as my step son will be racing go karts very soon. We fish and hunt. Love them both.

I guess what I'm getting at is there is a means to have your cake and eat it to. We race Bi-weekly as I'm not going to lose my house or family over racing. I was told if I found sponsorship for a full season we as a family would do a full season. It hasnt happened yet. If it does thats great. I worked at a local track on saturdays this year and we all suffered. We knew it would be tough going in but the extra money and resume building sure helped. Now that our season is over we've been getting back to the outdoors, camping, fishing and traveling. Its all about balance.

[paintguy]

What we must not forget here is that other people collect money (the race track) for us to to engoy our expensive hobbie. So a comparison to other sports or hobbies is allmost comparing apples to oranges

[JC]

Someone is collecting the money you're spending regardless. The racetrack at least gives some of it back.

[ron.m]

fishing pole 40.00 worms 2.00 dozen chair 25.00 McDonald coffee 1.00 not having to get into these discussions PRICELESS AND when I'm done I go home with my sanity.

[Nick Austin]

Attaboys for bbbr and Moselli....and shame on our moderator for even starting such an unnecessary and mean spirited thread!

I wouldn`t necessarily call it mean spirited, I think he was just venting more than anything. I can see how he gets frustrated by all the complaining about the economy and everything costing so much. It can get old after a while. Besides...
Wasn`t racing also expensive 10 years ago? Or 20? OR 30? Racing being expensive is nothing new . And at no point would I ever recommend that anyone count on winnings to help pay the bills. I kind of agree that if you don`t have the money you shouldn`t be trying to do it, especially if you have a family.

Personally, I waited 20 years before I felt I could "afford" to race. Money hasn`t been a huge problem, although I will be paying off the `ol credit card for quite a while. I haven`t had a lot of success, but had some fun and met some great people. I could probably figure out a way to fork out 20-30 grand for a brand new top notch street stock, but I won`t do it. At least not now. I have to draw the line somewhere. It took me half my life to climb out of poverty and I won`t go back to that.
I know a couple guys that keep trying to keep up with drivers that have the best of the best and it`s ruining them. They won`t answer the phone fearing bill collectors are calling, their car insurance is being cancelled, electric being shut off, etc. And they complain nonstop about how expensive racing is. In my opinion they should not be trying to do it. I wouldn`t necessarily  say stay home, but maybe take a step back or drop down a class. They need to be more realistic. Because in a way, their lifestyle is no better than the people on welfare that swear they can`t provide for their family, but always seem to have plenty of money for beer, cigarettes, and tattoos. And I have a real problem with that.
JMO.

[itchypav]

I believe Paz deserves a pass here. It's alright for all of us to complain or give our opinion but dam the moderator or admin for doing the same.

I own a car, have a son that races it and he also races for another team. It's expensive but it is fun. That's what we do for our entertainment. It is a family affair.

It's expensive and the "winnings' will never equal or even come close to the costs.

The rewards are 'immeasurable' though. What value do you attach to the excitement, when you do better than the last time or even win, the friendships, the talks and discussions with old friends and new. Think of what the "kid" could do as an alternative to our hobby.

If someone was telling the alcoholic to stop drinking because he was complaining all the time that the booze cost too much would you tell him to shutup and tell the alcoholic to go find cheaper alcohol?

[The Race Report]

All Paz did was put into words what we have always known...   Racing is a (very) expensive hobby.

Saturday afternoon Paz, Al Robinson, and I were watching racers who spent more this past weekend than most weekend warriors do in an entire season.  And the total purse for their three day event.....  ?  ZERO !!!   

So if you love it, and can afford it, do it!

Or build a kart and go win the $10,000 at Frozen Ocean next Sunday.
I'll be there to watch you win.....   

Ron Hills
The Race Report

[raceannouncer]

Mike, 

I think the last thing a moderator of this forum needs to do is encourage people who own race cars to stay home.  This forum, if I understood correctly, once was for the betterment of local racing.  Discussing issues, such as purses, costs of racing, the business of motorsports, etc. is exactly what this place was intended to do.

Occasionally people have opinions that don't agree with each other.  There is NOTHING wrong with that.  However, the attitude you seem to have taken with your comments and moderation lately is one of "take whatever the speedway says and eat it" or otherwise just shut up.  You are not promoting dialogue at all.

No one is racing on the local level to make money.  I don't think there is one racer here who is.  It boils down to how much money are you going to lose and trying to keep that loss reasonable enough to continue to put the car on the track and provide some entertainment to fans.  If there aren't race cars on the track, there aren't fans in the stands.  No fans in the stands, we have shopping malls instead of race tracks.  That simple.

OK I may not have expressed myself clearly. My comments were intended to PROMOTE racing by attempting to point out how really most of us are to have to compete at, which was the meat and potatoes of the post...apparently, my post was not read completely, only skimmed.  I am disappointed at the comments by thgose who complain about every little thing they can find!

Ron: I am grateful for your suppoirtive opinion but to be fair the vintage road racing guys make more money in one year than ALL the members on this board--COMBINED!

Daryl:  Thanks for the low blow. It really hurt--so NO MAS,NO MAS!!

I'll be glad to put on my "owner's hat" if and when you agree to trade your life with mine. I'll be more than willing to do just that...just show me how!!! and let me know when.  The sooner, the better!!


I guess that admins and moderators have NO right to express their opinion if it is contrary to a particular person's belief

[dirttrackrocker]

I believe Paz deserves a pass here. It's alright for all of us to complain or give our opinion but dam the moderator or admin for doing the same.

I own a car, have a son that races it and he also races for another team. It's expensive but it is fun. That's what we do for our entertainment. It is a family affair.

It's expensive and the "winnings' will never equal or even come close to the costs.

The rewards are 'immeasurable' though. What value do you attach to the excitement, when you do better than the last time or even win, the friendships, the talks and discussions with old friends and new. Think of what the "kid" could do as an alternative to our hobby.

If someone was telling the alcoholic to stop drinking because he was complaining all the time that the booze cost too much would you tell him to shutup and tell the alcoholic to go find cheaper alcohol?

^^^^^  What he said^^^^^   

[billyboy88]

I believe we got the message  of what your saying.You suit and ty guys have had it pretty good on that side of the fence,any of you have and time spent  as owner driver or wrench man?c-mon  over  to the other side for a while...........

[itchypav]

No one is racing on the local level to make money.  I don't think there is one racer here who is.  It boils down to how much money are you going to lose and trying to keep that loss reasonable enough to continue to put the car on the track and provide some entertainment to fans.

I would hope that people had the attitude when they went racing not of how much they were going to lose but: How well will I do tonight? Will I qualify? Will I do better than last week? Will I win? Did I fix that issue I had with setup? I do agree about thinking about how much entertainment you are providing to your fans. Absolutely, because that is what it is all about. Feeling proud about doing a good job and doing better? Being able to stand with your supporters and say I did good and talk about it. And when you don't to stand up and talk about it, laugh and figure it out for next week.

Been there. Worked since I was 12, paid for my education, worked some more, worked 2 jobs, risked everything to start a side business while working a full time job, on and on. Still work 70-90 hrs/week to go racing.  Blaming people for doing good is a crutch. It's called hard work, making good decisions and sometimes good luck. But it never entails giving up and blaming someone else for not succeeding.

[oldguy]

Suit and tie?  Not me.  I've ridden on both sides of that fence - still do.

Everyone, even Mike, is entitled to their opinion.

[raceannouncer]

This is going to be funny when Race Announcer has to lock down a thread he started! lol

You have my word that I'll won't do that!  I can't speak for admin, however...

The best way to make sure  it doesn't happen is NOT to make personal attacks or continue to bash the tracks that make it possible for the provide space to "buy the addictive drug" called racing!

[crankyhick]

I used to drink "ALOT", & wake up in the morning feeling like CRAP..Then I got deeply involved in racing & I wake up in the morning feeling "GREAT"....That is until I read junk like this on "raceny"..I don't always agree with anyone on raceny, but, Mikes point to me is simple, "race if you can (money) or join us who can't in the grandstands." Maybe I'll just stop my sponsorship deal & get a race car..I haven't had anything to moan & groan about lately, so I'll feel part of the crowd here on raceny....On the serious side; I admire all of you owner/drivers who provide my summertime fun..I know your all wanting more (money), but, there is only so much to go around..Hope to see many of your faces at the U.S. OPEN..