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Author Topic: Decision: 2016  (Read 5635 times)

2300

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Decision: 2016
« on: August 24, 2016, 09:48:14 PM »

Groundpounder

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Re: Decision: 2016
« Reply #1 on: August 25, 2016, 09:23:22 AM »
Damn good thing there's a third option!

"Crate engines are to racing what Tofurkey is to Thanksgiving" - Karl Fredrickson
Distrust all men in whom the impulse to punish is powerful. - Friedrich Nietzsche
We are descended in spirit from revolutionaries and rebels -- men and women who dare to dissent from accepted doctrine. - D. Eisenhower

2300

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Re: Decision: 2016
« Reply #2 on: August 25, 2016, 03:29:46 PM »
I hear you Groundpounder and we're in a vicious cycle for sure.  Of course the easy way is for most everyone to vote for someone like Gary Johnson, but....
....it ain't going to happen.  I wish this wasn't true, but as of now voting for an alternative is the same as one wishing the Washington Generals/New York Nationals would beat the Harlem Globetrotters.
For the record the Generals/Nationals won 2 games(and 1 win wasn't recognized by the Trotters)while losing over 14,000 games.  Sadly, that's better than Gary Johnson's chances.

Sit it out or hold your nose and vote.  Your Libertarian Party can win local elections, I just don't see it nationally for now.  My proof is in every Presidential election results. 
They need a bigger ground game for it to happen and winning more and more smaller elections is the ticket.  Right now they're not ready for prime time.  They think they are, they're not.
Name some Libertarian Senators, Congressmen, etc.?  It's a short list and they need to boost that to further succeed nationally.


Groundpounder

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Re: Decision: 2016
« Reply #3 on: August 25, 2016, 03:43:06 PM »
You can't go by past elections this time around. The Democrapublicans have never nominated two candidates as unpopular as they have this time around. If Johnson can get into the debates, then the white house is certainly within the realm of possibility. Don't let the 2 corrupt major parties convince you that they are your only 2 choices. They are scared right now that there is actually a chance they might lose their duopoly control over the country so they are pushing that false message harder than ever. You are not obligated in any way to cast your vote for one of those 2 nut jobs. It's YOUR vote, not theirs. Make it count this time!

60% think there should be a third major party. If just half of those actually voted for the leading third party, it would easily be enough to keep either of the other 2 clowns from winning a majority. Just think about that for a minute.
"Crate engines are to racing what Tofurkey is to Thanksgiving" - Karl Fredrickson
Distrust all men in whom the impulse to punish is powerful. - Friedrich Nietzsche
We are descended in spirit from revolutionaries and rebels -- men and women who dare to dissent from accepted doctrine. - D. Eisenhower

Groundpounder

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Re: Decision: 2016
« Reply #4 on: August 25, 2016, 05:27:19 PM »

https://libertarianvindicator.com/2016/08/21/new-abc-poll-says-1-in-3-voters-still-considering-a-third-party-in-november/

35% is easily enough to keep either of the 2 dingbats from reaching 50%.

Don't waste your vote on a lesser of two evils candidate that you don't really like.
"Crate engines are to racing what Tofurkey is to Thanksgiving" - Karl Fredrickson
Distrust all men in whom the impulse to punish is powerful. - Friedrich Nietzsche
We are descended in spirit from revolutionaries and rebels -- men and women who dare to dissent from accepted doctrine. - D. Eisenhower

2300

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Re: Decision: 2016
« Reply #5 on: August 25, 2016, 08:01:16 PM »
I applaud your beliefs but as I've mentioned before these alternative parties need to win other elections first before they can win "the big one".  I'm sorry, it's just how it is.
Every 4 years we hear how we need more choices, and we do, yet it never materializes.  How can one expect a Libertarian/Green/Blue/Orange party candidate to win the
Presidency when those parties don't even have many(if any) Senators, Congressmen, and down the line winning an election.  That's just plain reality.
From your link of 1 in 3 voters considering a third party:
"Asked how they would vote in a four-way race including Johnson and Stein, respondents to the ABC News/Washington Post poll released Aug. 7 gave Hillary Clinton an eight-point lead over Trump, 45 percent to 37 percent, with Johnson at 8 percent, and Stein at 4 percent."

So tell me again how Johnson or Stein going to win the Presidency this time?
My posts aren't in any way a vote for Clinton or Trump they're just saying schools go from Grades 1-12 and Third/Fourth/Fifth Parties want to do it by Grades 12-1.
In my opinion that's their downfall because politics are local.
Anyway....
Good luck in November and see you at the polls. :)


Groundpounder

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Re: Decision: 2016
« Reply #6 on: August 25, 2016, 10:39:33 PM »
I applaud your beliefs but as I've mentioned before these alternative parties need to win other elections first before they can win "the big one".  I'm sorry, it's just how it is.
Every 4 years we hear how we need more choices, and we do, yet it never materializes.  How can one expect a Libertarian/Green/Blue/Orange party candidate to win the
Presidency when those parties don't even have many(if any) Senators, Congressmen, and down the line winning an election.  That's just plain reality.

I have no idea where you got that from (probably another fallacy put out by the Democrapublican establishment), but that is not "reality" at all. Besides that, if Johnson were to win, there are a number of libertarian-minded current members of congress who who would likely switch party affiliation.

From your link of 1 in 3 voters considering a third party:
"Asked how they would vote in a four-way race including Johnson and Stein, respondents to the ABC News/Washington Post poll released Aug. 7 gave Hillary Clinton an eight-point lead over Trump, 45 percent to 37 percent, with Johnson at 8 percent, and Stein at 4 percent."

So tell me again how Johnson or Stein going to win the Presidency this time?
My posts aren't in any way a vote for Clinton or Trump they're just saying schools go from Grades 1-12 and Third/Fourth/Fifth Parties want to do it by Grades 12-1.
In my opinion that's their downfall because politics are local.
Anyway....
Good luck in November and see you at the polls. :)

That's one poll. Others have him as high as 13%. Right now, most Americans still don't know who he is. If he can raise that a couple more points and get in the debates, then most everyone will know who he is and the numbers will drastically change.
"Crate engines are to racing what Tofurkey is to Thanksgiving" - Karl Fredrickson
Distrust all men in whom the impulse to punish is powerful. - Friedrich Nietzsche
We are descended in spirit from revolutionaries and rebels -- men and women who dare to dissent from accepted doctrine. - D. Eisenhower

leadfoot4

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Re: Decision: 2016
« Reply #7 on: August 27, 2016, 02:25:41 PM »
I applaud your beliefs but as I've mentioned before these alternative parties need to win other elections first before they can win "the big one".  I'm sorry, it's just how it is.
Every 4 years we hear how we need more choices, and we do, yet it never materializes.  How can one expect a Libertarian/Green/Blue/Orange party candidate to win the
Presidency when those parties don't even have many(if any) Senators, Congressmen, and down the line winning an election.  That's just plain reality.



If there EVER was a "third party candidate" who had a LOT of momentum and support, it was Ross Perot, back in the 90s, and even he couldn't get it done. While I believe that DJT isn't an ideal candidate, he IS the man for the job RIGHT NOW. 4 years of Hillary, and America, as we've know and loved it for the last 200 years, will be toast.

Groundpounder

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Re: Decision: 2016
« Reply #8 on: August 27, 2016, 05:43:43 PM »
The thing Johnson has that Perot didn't is that he's running against the two most unpopular candidates in probably a century  (if not ever).

And a Trump presidency would be every bit as bad as a Hillary one, just in a few subtly different ways.
"Crate engines are to racing what Tofurkey is to Thanksgiving" - Karl Fredrickson
Distrust all men in whom the impulse to punish is powerful. - Friedrich Nietzsche
We are descended in spirit from revolutionaries and rebels -- men and women who dare to dissent from accepted doctrine. - D. Eisenhower


2300

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Re: Decision: 2016
« Reply #9 on: November 09, 2016, 06:17:30 PM »
I applaud your beliefs but as I've mentioned before these alternative parties need to win other elections first before they can win "the big one".  I'm sorry, it's just how it is.
Every 4 years we hear how we need more choices, and we do, yet it never materializes.  How can one expect a Libertarian/Green/Blue/Orange party candidate to win the
Presidency when those parties don't even have many(if any) Senators, Congressmen, and down the line winning an election.  That's just plain reality.

I have no idea where you got that from (probably another fallacy put out by the Democrapublican establishment), but that is not "reality" at all. Besides that, if Johnson were to win, there are a number of libertarian-minded current members of congress who who would likely switch party affiliation.

From your link of 1 in 3 voters considering a third party:
"Asked how they would vote in a four-way race including Johnson and Stein, respondents to the ABC News/Washington Post poll released Aug. 7 gave Hillary Clinton an eight-point lead over Trump, 45 percent to 37 percent, with Johnson at 8 percent, and Stein at 4 percent."

So tell me again how Johnson or Stein going to win the Presidency this time?
My posts aren't in any way a vote for Clinton or Trump they're just saying schools go from Grades 1-12 and Third/Fourth/Fifth Parties want to do it by Grades 12-1.
In my opinion that's their downfall because politics are local.
Anyway....
Good luck in November and see you at the polls. :)

That's one poll. Others have him as high as 13%. Right now, most Americans still don't know who he is. If he can raise that a couple more points and get in the debates, then most everyone will know who he is and the numbers will drastically change.
In no way am I trying to gloat over this Groundpounder, but who was more right on this subject?  Every 4 years we hear "this is the year" and every 4 years it never transpires.
Right now a Libertarian vote for President is nothing more than a wasted vote.  Some skewed poll had him as high as 13% which became 13% divided by 4.  And you said 2 1/2 months before the election "right now most Americans still don't know who he is" and somehow he was going to become President?  lol  Yep, I'm throwing my support and vote to What'sHisName.  C'mon.
As it is I don't ever see a Libertarian candidate ever winning the presidency.  I'd like to see it but I'd have to see far more than 13%.
Win local elections first and work up.  Libertarians want to win the World Series in April and the Super Bowl in August and once again neither you or I will ever see a Libertarian President.  Change the plans and it could come about.  Don't change and it's "this is the year" over and over.

Chargincharlie

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Re: Decision: 2016
« Reply #10 on: November 10, 2016, 09:48:18 PM »
They said Trump paid 4.50$ a vote while hillary spent just short of 10$ a vote can't wait to see what he can do with the budget start the cuts.

leadfoot4

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Re: Decision: 2016
« Reply #11 on: November 11, 2016, 05:40:03 PM »
They said Trump paid 4.50$ a vote while hillary spent just short of 10$ a vote can't wait to see what he can do with the budget start the cuts.

That's what happens when a businessman, spending his own money, gets into a contest with a politician, who's spending other people's money.....





uticamike

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Re: Decision: 2016
« Reply #12 on: November 14, 2016, 08:25:08 PM »
I like Pounders post from above. 60% says Gary Johnson the country wants a re third way.

Mr Excitement got a whole 3% of the vote so where Gary did the other 57% go?

Don't mess with the Geriatric Jackman

2300

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Re: Decision: 2016
« Reply #13 on: November 15, 2016, 02:50:25 PM »
I like Pounders post from above. 60% says Gary Johnson the country wants a re third way.

Mr Excitement got a whole 3% of the vote so where Gary did the other 57% go?
Answering your question and actually it should read "where did the other 95% of the 60% go?"with admittedly being a broken record, so....
....The Wednesday just after a Presidential election the Libertarian/Green/Blue/Orange/Whatevers disappear and 2 1/2-3 years later they'll resurface shouting "this is the year"
and yep just like on a shampoo bottle it's lather, rinse, and repeat ad infinitum.  I'm not saying it's right, I'm just speaking realistically and our two party system has too much
invested to bring about a different outcome.
And where is Groundpounder?


 

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