Author Topic: Dear ROC: Just maybe you can learn by reading this....  (Read 15941 times)

DKaz

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Dear ROC: Just maybe you can learn by reading this....
« on: October 30, 2016, 06:47:08 AM »
The ROC has issues. They cannot possibly think they don't. The amount of time they wasted yesterday on 15 cars in support divisions was maddening. It was almost unbelievable how poorly these past 2 ROC shows were run. I'd imagine that if you consider that they were just using the support divisions to dry and further blow the dirt off the track, the reasons become more plausible. Post Superdirt Week, the track was exactly what you would expect--total junk. It was dirty, single grooved and pretty loose. The front-stretch stands were even filthy and the pits looked like a swampy mess (and they're asphalt). I love the ROC Tour and the mods. I just cannot understand how the series can continue when they run shows like that. Consider that the series did little to nothing to communicate with the fans who got hosed at the last visit to Oswego. Consider that just yesterday the promoter had a published a hard start time of 3:30 for the 250 and at that time they were just getting cars on the track at a speed that kind of looked fast. Consider that the stands were empty for a second time because of knuckle headed promotion and management mistakes in September and yesterday. And consider that the teams, who have incredible sums of money tied up in their operations and racing expenses, were asked to run on a less than safe track. How can this continue?

A show like yesterday is exactly why there is no next generation of race fans. The fan demographic is aging and there will be few fans to replace them. All you needed to do was look around you in the stands yesterday. Few families. Few kids. Few women. And those that were there were subjected to 3 hours of half-***** track drying, (2) 15 minute warm-ups for a support class with 6 cars and more foot dragging than the first show. Racing falls in the sports and entertainment business. Consumers will take their dollars elsewhere and do something enjoyable and entertaining. Yesterday was the second ROC visit my family made to Oswego in a month that was less than enjoyable, let alone entertaining.  The sport needs to find more promoters like Tim Packman. The ROC remains in trouble.

How to solve the issues? The ROC should first pull together a round table group of track owners, team owners, drivers and fans. Not people that they're friends with or just the top teams. Pull together a diverse group and ask how they can improve for all parties involved--back gate and front. Take the feedback, don't argue with the participants and LISTEN. People are helpful by nature and will give you feedback and ideas that just might be helpful. And if the people are passionate about your business, you'll get very useful and productive feedback. Then take those ideas, put together an action plan and checklist and start to make changes. It's not impossible and would go a long way to making them a success. Continuing this way is a recipe for failure. I offer to be roundtable member #1. Listening to feedback--what a novel business idea. I can only imagine how difficult being a promoter and running a series must be. Tough decisions, tough calls to make, tough financial considerations. I get it. Let people help you.


Enjoy the off-season and forget about this mess. Thanks to the team who put so much time, effort, money and risk into the sport. So many truly dedicated and passionate people. There's also great promoters and tracks doing fantastic things for the drivers, fans, their employees and the sport in general. Embrace those situations and know there are good pockets of health in the sport out there. April will be here before you know it. Let's hope a more finely tuned ROC comes with it.


4b316

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Re: Dear ROC: Just maybe you can learn by reading this....
« Reply #1 on: October 30, 2016, 09:04:04 AM »
I'll agree with you  that ROC has some issues but we thought they did a pretty good job yesterday getting the track ready to go.Granted,maybe if they would of hired a bunch of people to come in the middle of the week and work in the rain and sweep the rest of the dirt off the track then had the guys pressure wash the corners off like they did then sweep the mud down the drains and got them to do it over again yesterday after the rain Friday wash the dirt off the outside of the track back down to the bottom.I was told that the track told ROC that they had removed the dirt from the track and that it was washed off and clean with just dust on it.Was you out on the track trying to get it dry with the rest of us driving around?I know it is not something the fans should have to do but if the show was going to go on,it had to be done.Track had a lot of water on it yet when we pulled off and they did the only thing they could do by getting some hot laps in to finish drying it.Still was basically one lane with the dirt still in the upper groove but at least raceable.ROC must of took a huge bath,money wise,but that's the chance you take with a late fall race in ny.Crowdwise,I have seen smaller shows on a Saturday nite when the chance of rain was high.A lot of the street stock have to tow a long way for iffy weather but thought more SB limiteds would be there.Should of been more prepared,had someone from ROC come check the track during the week or earlier Saturday but there again,it looked like more rain all morning.Damned if they do,damned if they don't

DKaz

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Re: Dear ROC: Just maybe you can learn by reading this....
« Reply #2 on: October 30, 2016, 09:47:59 AM »
They're running a business. When you go to a restaurant, do they ask you to come in to clean the floors, set all the tables and shovel the sidewalk in the winter before you can eat? No. Why? It's a business. Rather than people defending them and/or giving blind criticism, why don't we provide good feedback which they will actually consider? I literally reached out to them after the September ROC debacle and offered to help with PR and marketing (which I've been involved in for 25+ years). I'd be happy to give them FREE advice.

Know what their reply was? Nada.


racerdad

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Re: Dear ROC: Just maybe you can learn by reading this....
« Reply #3 on: October 30, 2016, 11:13:23 AM »
This race did more damage to the R.O.C. than good. I can understand wanting to race the 250 in the fall. But they would have been better off running it in the spring. I know people who trashed  the tickets after the first show say no need to keep them, they would not be going back. Racing today can not afford to loose fans because of bull$hit.  The best idea I heard all day came from Tony Hirschman. Run the show at Lancaster the first good weekend after the U.S.Open. the fans there would have filled the track. They would not have to wait for the dirt crap. The race track would have been a  race track not a train track.. That was no race yesterday at Oswego. That show is all on Joe. He should have thought this out way better. The fans where yelling in the stands to start the show. Like a mob out of control waitting for food. Just the worst show I have ever had to endure. The  pit stops where the worst. That is not racing. The show is over lets hope some people get together and never let this happen again. We could have gotten our car out but I would not do it in the end, I could see that being a waste of time and money.  Next year has to be better.



JMO Donald W Reynolds.


canadianfan

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Re: Dear ROC: Just maybe you can learn by reading this....
« Reply #4 on: October 30, 2016, 11:45:41 AM »
a lot of Canadian fans would attend too Don if it was at Lancaster. Still a lot of fans in the Golden Horseshoe here (Toronto-Hamilton-Niagara). Heck it's only 82 miles from my house in Burlington. Oswego is the best part of four hrs. And Sept is usually the best time of year for crossing the border with much less tourist traffic
Mike Lindsay-Burlington Ontario
so far-Delaware 1, Jukasa 4, Sunset 2, Flamboro 7, Ohsweken 4, Merrittville 4, Ransomville 1, Genesee 1, Volusia Speedway Park 1

sgt12

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Re: Dear ROC: Just maybe you can learn by reading this....
« Reply #5 on: October 30, 2016, 12:40:59 PM »
Although I applaud them getting in the ROC 250 yesterday, I do believe that the ROC brand has suffered some significant damage. 29 cars for a race with a lot of history is damning in and of itself.  When your signature event is no different than a regular series event, it smells of something.

I have no doubt the owner of the ROC took a financial beating over the past 6-8 weeks.  Low attendance and a half ***** race track yesterday proved to very difficult to digest.  I haven't missed the ROC 200 since the early 80's and I'm sure my conscience will pull me back next year, but it's getting harder and harder to commit to it.


Hoosierfan22

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Re: Dear ROC: Just maybe you can learn by reading this....
« Reply #6 on: October 30, 2016, 01:45:17 PM »
That show is all on Joe.

JMO Donald W Reynolds.

Really?  You think all that mud still being on the track is all on Joe?  Do you think only 200 fans showing up for the first date in September is all on Joe to?  People need to realize this guy put his a ss on the line and the fans and teams didn't show up period.


Hoosierfan22

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Re: Dear ROC: Just maybe you can learn by reading this....
« Reply #7 on: October 30, 2016, 01:51:39 PM »
Harpell knew this was coming.  He tried changing the 200 to a summer date a few years ago.  It didn't work.  Harpell moved it to Chemung last year but bad weather and a questionable "short" track didn't have the RoC atmosphere but I bet you he didn't go in the hole like the new promoter did this year.  I don't know if the RoC promoter will have the RoC at Oswego again but if he does the fans better support it no matter what the weather forecast is or it will be gone.


retired hamburger

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Re: Dear ROC: Just maybe you can learn by reading this....
« Reply #8 on: October 30, 2016, 02:16:15 PM »
Well yes this one is all on joe the promoter. It was his decision to cancel the show in Sept due to the "pending rain, which after a small shower never rained again until 9:00pm. Next he saw that he was going to loose or maybe draw even after he saw his stands. So he drew itout until 2:00 and then cancelled. Next having no alternet plan for a rain date. He could have talked to lancaster and made a rain date quicker. He may have lost some people from nj or wester pa but he would have had a quicker date. Any date in October for a race is crazy to start with racing in the east runs from late april to late Sept period. I fear that the historic race of champs and there are many historic champs has been sold to a guy that is not a promoter. I was surprised that there was any show at all. Cleaning up dirt on asphalt is bad enough but then not seeing the track and demanding it be cleaned perfectly was Joes fault first and formost then since the track has been a one lane track for some time he after it was cleaned could of sprayed the adhesive material refered to as coke syrup all over the track prior to Saturdays debacle. I hope you can salvage your less than great start. But I'm skeptical.


racerdad

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Re: Dear ROC: Just maybe you can learn by reading this....
« Reply #9 on: October 30, 2016, 02:23:08 PM »
Hooiserfan22. Yes I do. Who made the call to hold it at Oswego. Who didn't run the show on the first date ? who didn't run on the rain date?. Who let teams and fans take time off of work , get hotels,  spend time and money getting to Oswego. Maybe it is time for some changes. I have not missed a 200 in many years and every year the turn out is getting less and less for both teams and fans. Even on the regular shows the people do not show there. With the weather forcast the first time it was a no brainner to see it would not go well. People will just not put up with bad weather and knowing what they will spend. When fans walk out the gate and throw the 40 ticket they bought in the trash can on the way out because they will not support the calls made what do you call it. As far as last year I never would have even tried Chemung for the 200. Last year if I had a vote I would have gone with Lancaster.  Like i said in my post it is how I see it. Look around must be some other people feeling upset as well. It is not getting better year in and year out.

Don Reyonlds

« Last Edit: October 30, 2016, 02:29:56 PM by racerdad »


Hoosierfan22

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Re: Dear ROC: Just maybe you can learn by reading this....
« Reply #10 on: October 30, 2016, 02:30:39 PM »
He already ran half the RoC weekend at Oswego in September.  You have no idea what his contracts say and what he is obligated to do with sponsors.  If you think he would of been close to breaking even in September you are nuts.  There was 3 times as many people there yesterday (700 or less) and I bet you he still lost between $12,000-$15,000.  It isn't rocket science and everyone knows that (impending weather) wasn't the real reason he cancelled the first date it was just the (PC) politically correct way of saying this weekend is a bust.  However it wasn't a lie because the rain was going to be close.  Why is it so hard to realize that he had hardly nobody in the stands and he was trying to save the RoC from going in debt?

How much do you think it cost to rent Oswego Speedway for 3 days?

racerdad

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Re: Dear ROC: Just maybe you can learn by reading this....
« Reply #11 on: October 30, 2016, 02:32:46 PM »
Yep.


oneill71mod

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Re: Dear ROC: Just maybe you can learn by reading this....
« Reply #12 on: October 30, 2016, 02:55:40 PM »
To many classes of cars and still relying on the back gate and the racers back to pay the purse...way too expensive at the front gate for this show...come on folks it isn't like it's the supermod classic,which is a show case race..get rid of most of the support classes maybe have one or two,lower the front and rear gate prices and make the focus on the mods...adding some good money to the purse will get more cars too...
No “I’m not interested in owning a track or promoting your series 😀”

oneill71mod

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Re: Dear ROC: Just maybe you can learn by reading this....
« Reply #13 on: October 30, 2016, 02:58:55 PM »
Ps...we don't want the tour guys either,most of the time thehey are bogus anyways and the tech lets them pass...history has proven that...
No “I’m not interested in owning a track or promoting your series 😀”

Shamrock 3x

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Re: Dear ROC: Just maybe you can learn by reading this....
« Reply #14 on: October 30, 2016, 04:36:33 PM »
"I have no doubt the owner of the ROC took a financial beating over the past 6-8 weeks."

This is what it boils down to.  The delays were maddening, but it was clear from 1 PM on that the "promotor" did NOT want to get the show in.  He was banking on the weather eventually arriving and saving him from paying the purse.  Well, mother nature had other ideas and the weather turned out just fine.  I'm sure he took a bath, financially, and I hate it for him.  Although...one could say he only had himself to blame.